oh man i just wanted to touch on this cause hi hello! my threat was mentioned here haha [also this is to everyone but I wanted to respond directly to some stuff in this reply too so]

but yeah like... it's taken me years and i'm STILL learning new and better ways to create things without needing references. Most of the times I've drawn without references has been entirely muscle memory i've gotten from tracing 3d models, doing photobashing and other such things... . and for awhile there after my health dwindling and not drawing for over a year I actually kind of.. forgot how to draw?? Not literally but I could only draw by tracing 3d models I could not for the life of me figure out anatomy or poses anymore even using references I frequently had to trace multiple times and use that was a refernce or just say fuck it and trace the model i spent 2 hours posing haha.

but also <3 i hate 3d modeling i'm SO bad at it and I want to learn at some point! [when my health is better and i don't have constant brain fog and fatigue making learning a new skill near impossible atm]] but it reminded me of something I used to do a lot as a teenager [and still do when I'm burnt out].. sometimes I just switch to a medium i rarely work with. Like making stuff with paperclay, or I paint, or I draw stuff in the dirt. Hell sometimes I'll do makeup or hair[shout out to my 3 months of doing drag alone in my room just for funsies] or literally anything creative I can think of

but here's the kicker

i just make things. No references, no trying to create something exact. Just fiddling and tweaking things until I either get so mad I wanna throw it away, or I find something i'm satisfied with. Then after that! I'll look up videos or tutorials or whatever. Then decide if I wanna try again or relegate it to a task I do not have the energy to learn atm haha. Buti 'ts a GREAT way to like freshen a mind for art.

Sometimes when i'm struggling with art block or I can't think of anything I want to do or make I'll just kind of.. watch a lot of doll customization videos. A lot of them might just be really straight forward, but some take you through the entire design process and then you get to see how it translates from a drawing they made [or references and moodboards they've compiled] into something tangible and 3d. Doll customizations are really cool too cause they combine 2d and 3d art in a way that's hard to explain without watching it.

anyway excuse if i have any typos I currently have elbow tendinitis and this took me an insanely long time to type as clearly as is cause i have a headache and brain fog rn :| andi don't wanna bother my arm too much going and retyping things

thanks to anyone who read and I hope this helps even if it's just a good distraction lmao

[also also I posted an update/reply on my thread about aphantasia with some pictures and a link to my stream where you can see more stuff]

so so so so sooo many great and amazing and mediocre artists alike have tens if not hundreds if not THOUSANDS of works they've abandoned or didn't finish.

Some people have one single passion project they work on for the entire lives and abandon and forget little ones along the way.. some people just have fun and throw away things and leave them half finished but for them that is finished

I was stuck in the mindset of never finishing things for so long i never let myself make *anything*. I stopped drawing, i stopped writing, i stopped making music.. everything i've ever wanted to accomplish i just gave up on entirely. It was probably the second worst year of my life because I was so caught up on "what's the point if I don't finish" or being upset at my literal hundreds of given up on and abandoned projects that never went anywhere and never would. I felt so dejected and I was only 21 at the time. I had just dropped out of art college and decided nothing would ever be good enough even if i could complete it because I spent so long not completing things.

not completing things though, is just part of the journey. We don't finish every single meal we eat, we don't always do every single thing in our lives to 100% perfect completion. Relationships end early, we do bad on tests, we miss work, we lose passion, we start over , and over and over

and that's like the beauty of life and art the fact we can start over. We can start over and make new things as much as we want! there's no limit! you can just create things forever!

I feel like i'm spamming this thread replying to a bunch of others but :')) I wanted to post my own personal thing here.

disclaimer I'm not looking for advice really just want to share i think my therapist would be proud of me for talking about it ""publicly"" lmao

but anyway... .. . i just really wish people understood how hard it is to be a disabled artist sometimes. Somedays I'm sooo full of creativity and I want to do things and make things but my body hurts so bad and my brain fog and fatigue are so intense i'm not able to do anything.. or like right now i'm dealing wtih a bout of elbow tendinitis in my drawing arm and i'm def overusing it but i just don't know what else to do but draw and create things!

i'm doing my best to rest it for now and just keep up with stretches and yadda yadda, but i sometimes worry that one day I'll never be able to draw again and it locks me in this state of like.... "i'm waiting for something" like it's something folks who have adhd and anxiety often deal with like a perpetual state of waiting for something to happen or waiting until an appointment or waiting to go somewhere and then you have choice paralysis and can't do ANYTHING until the thing happens.

like i'm waiting to get better, i'm waiting to be less tired, i'm waitnig to do xyz.. and then I do nothing from a mixture of the choice paralysis and a mixture of being scared of losing my ability to draw if I end up with carpal tunnel or something worse.

I'm trying my best to stay positive lately though because I truly love and adore creating things and it means the world to me.. but with all that and the fact I haven't been able to have a job in 3 years and still can't work any time soon due to my health and what not... i can't help but feel like i'm just kind of trapped stagnating and trying to force myself to figure out a way to make money with my art before i finally get kicked out or my health dwindles so bad i need a caretaker.

I think making a career out of creating things would be a dream come true [especially because i do so many things like i even make music and write and what not. I used to sew plushies before my chronic pain got too bad and i'd like to do that again at some point but i'd have to get my designs produced elsewhere if i ever wanted to sell em haha] but it's exhausting feeling like I *have* to do that because I don't really have any other choice besides hopefully getting on ssi.

ANYWHO that was slightly heavier than i thought but thank you to anyone who read. I love art and i hope you guys do too.

This is me. I work on something passionately and then being alone in all, no encouragement, no progression I give up. Ok, i lied. This was me.

last year changed this in me though. You see I almost died last year. Twice. I stopped breathing. Twice. For two different reasons and I started to think is universe trying to tell me something.

So come 2023 I found my new passion project and I told my friends that if I do not complete this I never do a single artistic thing ever again. To the point it has become of an obsession, but I do want to complete something before 2022 alike year happens again. So what if I flip my shoes one day and all I left behind me is bundle of stuff that have no meaning not to me, not for anyone else.

I could have looked at AI and dying scene of human artist, but I think now that "today is the 1st day of rest of my life". I either do something about or do not. So I am driven to complete this project some way and learn things I must learn to achieve this. Does it take 5-10-15 years, I have no idea, but least next time I stop breathing i can think that "this time I at least tried and gave my best".

I feel many people stop driving themselves towards their goals because they feel no support or seek external validation instead looking for internal drive and validation.

i think it's important to remember that most good artists, aphantasia or not, use references all the time. there should be no shame in using them, specially when they're so handy. (sorry i didn't reply to anything else xP)

oh i know idc about using references and I do use them A LOT. I have no shame in that and I think it's weird when people assume I do just because I try to not use references sometimes.

it's just when you do have aphantasia sometimes you have to force yourself to not use references in order to create original stuff cause otherwise you never really train your brain to create things without them, especially when you see nothing like I do. Not having a visual memory and only having some kind of visual recognition of things and being unable to visualize even the vaguest little blob, 99% of drawing relies entirely on muscle memory and other types of memories and stuff that are not visual.. .so you have to train without references more deliberately than people who can recall things visually or make them up in their head.

honestly for me i'm just glad to be making things now. I'm disabled and might lose my ability to draw sooner than others of similar ages, so I'm more interested in just enjoying the process than in finishing anything.

I have sooooo many ideas for games and comics and so many things I wanna create but if I got too caught up on working on only one project or trying to finish every little thing I wanted, I would burn out within weeks.

I think because I have little to no support people assume I just don't have passion or that soemthing else must be preventing me from finishing all the big things I wanna make.. and it's just like.. no I just literally do not have the energy or physical capacity to learn enough things or to put all my energy into one project so I take my happiness in the creation of everything <3 Having goals that are genuinely unnatainable and constantly grinding yourself against stone to get to them is just as bad as going "Well maybe i'll finish it one day!" ya know? like obviously i'm not giving up on anything like some people might haha but i just can't be caught up in the "woe is me i'll never finish anything" or the obsession of finishing a single thing.

oh! i see. that sounds interesting.

Honestly been feeling pretty down about my art in general lately. I've always tried to take a sorta laid back approach to art, as in not worrying about interaction or engagement cuz I've told myself my art is a thing for me and attention shouldn't matter. But lately, I can't help but get frustrated when a piece I work on for potentially hours gets nothing at all. All the worse with my comic, where a single chapter will take me a month or longer, and I'm getting about the same

It's not even that I'm bitter, I'm not saying I "deserve" attention. I know my art isn't perfect, there's plenty better than me and I'm okay with that. I'm just more frustrated with myself, cuz it seems most of the factors that lead to this poor engagement is stuff outside of actually drawing

I think the main thing is just my inability to market myself. Mainly due to not being savvy to stuff like ideal times to post or what the current thing is that'll get eyes on my stuff. But I also just have this weird, inherent reluctance to draw attention to myself. Idk if that's anxiety or what, I just don't network or engage with people very well. I never have, even irl lol. It especially affects me with my comic. Like, me mentioning it here now, in this thread, is the most I've "advertised" it in months. It just feels weird to promote something that isn't fanart. Like I'm asking people to see a part of me that I'd rather not be known or feels more personal than the usual fanart stuff

I also just feel kinda lost as to what I oughta be aiming for. Like, I got the brainworm that maybe I should finally start making money off art, pursue a career in it. But I have no earthly clue how I'd even start something like that or even if that's something I should bother considering at this point. Like, if I got into art earlier in life, then I'd maybe have a better idea of things. I know it factually isn't but it kinda FEELS like thinking of stuff like that is too late, or I should have went to a proper art school or something if that's something I'd want. Like, I feel stuck in this loop of just making pretty pictures that aren't doing me any good ultimately and it feels like that's how my art journey is going to remain unless I change something, but it's a case of not knowing exactly what that something is

I do apologize if this is overly long and rambly. I hope I haven't come off as whiny, I'm still trying to be positive. I've stopped being stingy and ordered a proper drawing tablet cuz something tells me my lineart and stuff can only get better if I'm not using a mouse lol. Will also skip the traditional aspect of my workflow, which is a shame but will hopefully mean I can work faster. It's not as though that traditional aspect is even noticeable, with the way I work, I'll be better off just going full on digital I think. I'm also gonna take a break from creating to do a bit of learning. Maybe look into storyboarding, animation, even just maybe brushing up on fundamental stuff idk. Will help me get used to the tablet, will help me improve overall and hopefully get my head in a much calmer place

If you've read all this, I do appreciate it and thanks for your time

I relate to alot of what you said here, i have a weird relationship with showing my art to people since i think my low confidence kinda leads to self-sabotage. A big step for me was just getting onto this site and really communicating with other artists, which i had solely relied on IRL connections to artists for loads of inspiration but bit by bit each of them don't make art anymore and now its like "is this a good use of time?" but im not giving up or anything, and joining NG last year was a big boost to my inspiration.

Getting an actual tablet is a major learning curve but I really love the process more than traditional (its basic bitch of me to say but the addition of a undo button made the whole purchase worth it). Now im in this weird place of transitioning all my OCs from my traditional stuff to digital while trying to update their designs. I know this is just a form of procrastination and that the best thing for me getting my comic done would be to start drawing it, but I just feel so unequipped to handle all of the non-drawing aspects. Id love to collab with someone, but i know that means compromising a vision which again doesnt bother me that much, but I really don't like flakes or being a flake so i feel a bit...stuck. I even tried to make a shorter comic to help prepare solo work, but my brain couldnt stray far from my original idea.

Not asking pity or anything, just venting, but i deffo relate to that weird "lost" artist feeling.

Personally I feel like a lot of my enthusiasm and motivation comes in bursts where I can almost hyper-fixate on finishing a project or something, but once I lose steam, it becomes a slog and I end up dragging my feet on either not finishing things or not posting them. Been trying to get back into the swing of things so I can manage my stuff better but it's been irritating as hell.

Also, lazy so I'm combining another post I wanted to make: Wanted to ask what tips anyone had relating to promoting/advertising yourself on other platforms, it's annoying and tedious but kinda necessary. I did find some stuff that I think is worth sharing, I would definitely recommend that google sheets calculator though because I think it's just a really handy thing to have if budgeting is a bit difficult. No idea how relevant some of the twitter related stuff is because it's... changing to say the least, but here's some of that as well.

____________________________________________________________________________________

Growth/Visibility Tip

Freelance Tip

Google Sheets Freelance Calculator

God, you just put into words how I often am for art, music, or any other creative endeavor. I’ve been trying to make smaller artworks that can be finished during the burst of motivation to keep me from feeling like art itself is a slog, but I’m not always successful haha.

Thank you so much for all the tips, by the way! They’re really useful!

Pretty late on saying this, but this is a pretty cool idea for a thread. I really enjoyed reading a lot of the responses.

Anyways, my poor mindset towards my work has been a massive problem for years. It became so unbearable to the point that drove me to shut down my last NG account [which was 8 years old]. I was madly obsessed with getting a frontpage. When people eventually started sharing my art as frontpage suggestions, it always got rejected. As someone who has severely bad self-esteem, it really crushed me. One day I just decided to nuke my account and leave NG. I love this place, so I knew deep down that I would come back eventually.

As initially sad I was to let it all go, I felt like a lot of weight lifted off my shoulders and I became happier over time. I am much more focused on my studies as I have been drawing privately for the past few months now. It felt good not having to be distracted by a massive feed daily. I favorited other people's work a lot [had around like 10K favorites on my account---jeez]. It is so much easier to recognize my progress and improvements as a result. 

I would love to give the art portal another go down the road, but I am perfectly content with continuing to draw privately and improving myself. I don't want to fall into the trap and try to play the popular, cool internet kid again. 

This threads what we need, man

I've been hating making art for like the past few years. It went from obssessing over making it to the frontpage to having the need to do it from the weight of the world, like if i don't do this im not gonna be anything else. That shit turned to self-hate.

My advice is that art should just be made to be made. To live, to give and let go.

sense of fulfillment, or escapism, or when im bored.

I love making things, i love to push myself, but i just gotta remember what truly matters.

The love and the burn of making what matters to you.

Coming up and creating characters is also like candy to me and it's something i wanna keep for myself to enjoy.

Maybe one day i'll share my stuff on newgrounds, but for now it's staying inside my book/computer.

Advice again, find something to do and document, why not.

I was so close to nuking my own account one time, for the very same reason.

Obsession is a bitch

While I am super-new to Newgrounds in general, I've been feeling a bit discouraged at how other artists have treated me or how I've been seen by them.

I primarily like to do NSFW art and have certain fetishes I can't just ignore .. and it's been demoralizing to me that when I tried to meet and talk with other artists it usually ended with a sort of "you don't belong to our tribe/circle" attitude that left to me being either ignored outright or only asked for favors/free things.

Some of my earliest art trades have effectively gone in limbo because those people had commentary on my work-in-progress art and had moments to roast my art (and myself) for me to see .. and it's just left me not wanting to exactly associate with them and it led into really unfortunate discussions while I was going through real-life situations (dealing with a funeral and setting that up - while also being bombarded with super-negative messages).

I want to meet artists, I want to connect with others, and I'd like to try and get involved in projects and helping other in general .. but I feel like I'm isolated on every other place I was at like FurAffinity, Twitter, Reddit, and even BlueSky.

Fairly new to newgrounds here, but been at it since early 2020.

I took part in an art program on udemy, and joined a facebook group with other folks learning to draw as well. There was a wide variety of folks in that space, but it felt really disheartening to see folks say "This my first attempt at the lesson! I hope it's not too ugly Dx" and it's just a REALLY good, realistic piece of an eye. It stung to see that when I couldn't achieve that. In the end, I took a break, and came back at it. I left the group, and just focused on my own since then. I'm still trying to learn as I go.

The main thing for me is that as long as I enjoy what I do, I'm good. Much like life, I'm on my own path on this, and those who spew only negatives are clearly in their own rut to make themselves feel better. Just keep at it, and don't beat yourself up so much. You're doing fine.

Those 'this is my 1st' people are just baiting for likes and such and rarely actually posting their '1st' work.

Like sure I can say "my 1st Blender animation" and post something that make people fall of chair, and when I post my '1st blender texturing project' or my '1st substance painter' thing... but i did not start animation with Blender, and I did not start texturing in 3D in 2021 and my 1st Substance painter texture looks professional because I have done same thing professionally with other more complex programs before.

And if I'd post here my "1st krita drawing" - I am sure it would sound like I just started digital art and illustrations.

Long story short - those people are likely lying to bait good comments.

Fetishes are like they are. While most normal people would just scroll by and leave to find things they like, others would do anything to put other people down to feel better for themselves. More niche your thing, harder to find people, who understand you, but fact is that 'your people' are out there. As an artist you have to understand that internet and world is full of Karens and general trolls and it is up to you to build mental walls to keep yourself on your road.

Most of us have our particularities and most of us have opinions about other peoples kinks, but normal human beings do not need to be little others and since those internet trolls are not important, you shouldn't concern yourself with their opinion and tribalism.

I looked at your gallery, this is not my kink nor my cup of tea, but trust me - in NG are quite few artists with similar kinks and have seen quite a few in DA. Interact more with people, who share same idea, build your personal friends-list and contacts with other artists following same themes. You are not alone in this.

Im mainly just struggling with trying to find a style or where to find inspiration

I've tried searching on pinterest, google, etc.

I dont really know what to do.

Honestly I know i'm not perfect, but one thing i do know is you cannot force an art style on yourself. Art is just an expression of what you have fun creating, and the style is what other people put on you after they see patterns and similarities in the minutia appear.

Just have fun with making art, if you arent having fun then motivation will dry up extremely fast. Once you start having fun again you can start to be a bit more introspective and try and notice what you're good at and where your weaknesses are but dont get ahead of yourself.

Motivation is tricky tbh, ive always been told that arts is like farts and if you have to force it its probably shit, but in those times id usually do the boring practice like gesture drawings and that sorta thing that doesnt need imagination but will improve the fundamentals.

But First things first is have fun.

I know this is a late reply but wow, I felt this on a personal level lol, specifically the whole "playing the popular" thing. I abandoned my old NG account for literally the exact same reason as you did. It also had to do with my increasing obsession with the Newgrounds general bbs before it was shut down-- and thank God it did or else I would've gone insane out desperation. After a long hiatus from social media and gaining some new religious outlook in life I've been feeling a lot better about myself and my work.

A lot of the times I felt like my frontpages were really undeserved and I'd get one semi-frequently. I was rarely ever fond of my frontpaged artwork and yet for some reason people just really liked my art. I was even mentioned on someone's podcast/NG radio and invited to a discord a few years back. The times I was frontpaged, I'd get this burst of anxiety/pressure that I NEED to make something just as good, if not better than what I've just made, in hopes of more recognition. Of course, this only led to disappointment when the artwork that I had been proud of gets next to nothing. The cycle would continue until I started to post frequently to the bbs in hopes I would get something there instead. So basically, I was obsessed with gaining popularity and attention online despite the fact that I'm the complete opposite off screen. It was a strange dilemma and I was subsequently driven towards loneliness and confusion.

Nowadays I still post occasionally to the art forums, but it's really all for fun. Sometimes I just enjoy showcasing my stupid doodles and I like seeing my "art dump" thread grow as it acts as a progress marker. I rarely ever post anything to the art portal now-- which I will pick up with eventually-- but for now I'm really just having fun.

Hey y'all.

If you're in need of a way to fight perfectionism in your art, try daily sketches. Doesn't matter how messy they look, just post 'em. Make 'em funny, make 'em like concept art, whatever art ideas have been waiting to get out.

Here's mine.

I don't like admitting I'm having a rough time, but this past month has been kinda demoralizing for me. It's just been a punctuated series of events where I'm enthusiastic, thinking I'm making progress, having good ideas, and just running straight into brick walls when it comes to how it all gets received. I want to think of myself as self-motivated, but if that was the case, it wouldn't ruin my day whenever I fail to get the reaction I want. I don't want to let all these shitty days getting piled on back-to-back to slow me down - I can get into that "I will not be denied" mode when I need to, but it's a bitter and lonely existence staying in that mode for too long. It's easy when things are going well to take an occasional loss in stride, but it gets exponentially harder to give it all you've got when the last several times you tried your best are just flop after flop.

Really sorry to hear you're feeling this way. I don't know if I'm going to be helpful, but I feel the need to reply to this, so here's hoping that I at least won't be unhelpful.

There is nothing wrong with getting demoralized when you feel like all the effort you're putting into your work isn't being "compensated" with the kind of reception that would be appropriate for said level of effort. I think it's a very human way to feel. Nobody is 100% internally motivated, and it is impossible to not be affected by reception, feedback and other external responses to your work. I read a long time ago that an emotion is basically something we feel when our expectations don't match reality. Obviously, if something goes better than we expected, we feel joy, gratitude, pride etc. But if we invest a lot of our time, energy and passion into something only for it to land with a figurative thud, we feel sad and demotivated. I guess what I'm trying to say is - let yourself feel the way you feel, and don't beat yourself up about it. The way you're feeling now is completely expected and understandable considering the situation.

Again, don't know if this helps in any way, but as long as it didn't make you feel worse that's all that matters. All the best and good luck with your art, no matter how you feel right now you're doing a great job.

I cant really offer any solutions because i def relate to this. Feeling like you make an artistic breakthrough and being met with a resounding...nothing can really take the wind outta yer sails. I think that venting here, and at least finding this community of artists online has helped a little. Seeing that everyone is on their own path, just at different stages helps keep things in perspective.

I know your art and the work ethic you have has def inspired me to keep going, even if im not great at communicating that :V Online ineractions isnt something im well practiced at, but NG has really helped me to open up. Before joining up it felt like i was offering my art up to a hurricane, and anything i made was just ripped from my hands and gone, no matter how much time and effort i put into it. Now at least its like I share a bunker where i keep all my shit, and can see other peoples stuff too.

Sorry for the rambly long-winded metaphors just wanted to express that your post resonated wit me and at the very least. we can be lonely and bitter together as we move towards our art goals >:D

I've been feeling the discouragement for a long time, but I've never really spoke much about it. I'd say the main source would be not having any job or source of income as of currently... and the thing is, I'd originally hoped to be a professional artist working at a studio, but now that dream seems to have slipped away... I got half way through second year in art school before having to drop out. I did learn a fair bit, but overall, it felt like a waste. Barely even made any friends there, and in fact, I've never even had any other "artsy" types of friends growing up (at least, none who'd do my kind of genre). Admittedly, I'm also not much good at making friends in general. My interests have always made me kinda weird that way. So anyway, at this point I'm basically stuck between thinking this is what I wanna do, and I've just been making excuses not to put in enough effort, vs this was never a practical goal for me in the first place, and that things would've been better for me if I could just "get real", fall in line and study something most other people look to for a career. Instead I'm just festering in irrelevance.

I've lost a lot of my enthusiasm for art myself the past year or so, and it's not because my art hasn't gotten any better, which I feel it has. But I've been noticing a lot of my online "friends" stop faving or commenting on my artworks, and generally interacting with me less, so I'm feeling like maybe they never really liked me or the style of my artworks at all, and grew tired of pretending. I've also struggled to make many new friends lately, especially here on Newgrounds. When I feel like nearly everybody has already decided they hate me, or that they are just pretending to like me, it puts me off interacting with new people.

The spread of AI "art" doesn't help matters much: spending hours of my free time trying to please what fans I have by producing artworks that get fewer faves than unskilled people typing prompts into a machine... Newgrounds just randomly de-scouting me with no warning or explanation, seemingly irreversibly, hasn't done my mental health much good either... What's the point of me even continuing to post to this site when nobody can ever see what I make? Fat chance I'll ever get one of my artworks frontpaged either...

I have over 1K watchers on DeviantArt? Whoop-de-doo. The future of the internet is so uncertain at the moment, that being popular on a single platform is meaningless. I want to be able to make a mark on sites other than DeviantArt in order to have a hope at become a success, but none of them seem willing to give me a chance. Before we know it, DeviantArt won't even be a thing anymore, and then there go all my "fans" with it.

I think next year, if I continue making art at all, I will make far fewer drawings. I'll just focus on completing my outstanding trades, and learning some new skills like animation and 3D modelling that AI hasn't truly mastered yet. Might be able to use these skills in some of my upcoming video games and other projects anyway...

I’d say that’s a good path to take. Games and movies get much more lasting attention on NG and on the internet in general, so perhaps that will solve your initial problem.

I can’t give you advice for your specific situation, since I don’t have the experience and everyone I’ve encountered with this kind of problem is wildly different, but I’d always recommend looking into ways to make a compromise - either an art adjacent on you can do that doesn’t require as much formal training, or another hobby you have that you can do for a living.

Hope so...